A Hikkikomori StopGap

Introducing the Temporary Hikikomori StopGap Forum

HikiCulture Admin Strongly Suspected of Spamming

First off, my apologies for the image quality.

I’m very newbish at image editing and it was only this year that I discovered what “cropping” does.

Anyways, on to the topic.

The short version:

Someone has recently been spamming the HikiPhpBB forum. (1st screenshot)

There’s strong evidence that it is the admin of another Hikikomori forum, HikiCulture.

Evidence #1 is the conversation in the 2nd screenshot.

If the text is blurry, here’s the conversation:

Chair:

Me and thirteen other people are talking about you in my IRC channel right now Foolness.

Do you think we are saying positive, or negative things? You have a day to answer. If you don’t answer, I’ll beat you up.

(spamming occurs)

Later on…

“…”:

Cut this bullshit out now. You two have a problem, keep it off this board.

Google: (2nd spam account)

Wut R U gonna do about it tuff guy?

Evidence #2 is where this “Google” account pmed me:

Hi.

Sent at: Thu Oct 29, 2009 12:26 am
From: Google
To: Foolness

I’m Mr. Google, how R U?

The long version:

This all started with this blog post: Is HikiCulture turning more and more into a spam forum?

Then 2 HikiCulture admin (1 new, 1 the founder and user “Chair”) brought up some unrelated accusations of my time in the HikiCulture forum which prompted me to address the issue in a separate blog post:

Reply to Chair/HikiCulture admin

Around this time, the events prompted me to make two topics. One in the AnonIB /hikikomori/ board which is now deleted per the request of a user and another here.

If you visit the two above links, you’ll see how the events got cleared up under the comments.

After my name was cleared up and it turned out the accusation was mistakenly directed at me by a new admin, I focused on other blog posts I was working on and became inactive from the HikiPhpBB forum.

In particular I was kept busy by my recent blog post because of all the problems I have with getting it to post correctly.

Only after, did I return to the forum and address Chair’s recent reply to me. (I didn’t actually leave the forum though since that blog post was in reply to a topic made in that forum.)

That was when all these happened.

For a copy of my reply and Chair’s original post, just look at the last comment underneath the “Reply to Chair/HikiCulture admin” topic.

If the formatting is hard to read though, here’s my reply: (Note that Chair’s reply is chopped up into quotes)

Chair:

Sorry for being somewhat rude in my reply Foolness, I just don’t enjoy people making wild assumptions about me. In the future, if you want to know what my intentions are in anything I do, please email me at {{{e-mail removed}}}

Me:

Problem is, if you understood the context of the blog, I’m not even sure it was you who was editing the wikipedia article so why would I contact you?

If it was you however, then similarly, why should you be trusted to not censor the conversation when you have already strongly removed someone else’s post from a site you don’t own?

Contacting you privately was just not an option and the actions of both you and your fellow admin under the comment section further made it hard to follow that approach.

Chair:

I’ll likely respond to your email within a day or two of receiving it. I ask you of one thing though - if I’m to send you an email, please do not quote anything that I am to say in any of your blogs or elsewhere. If you do not comply with this request, I will not respond to any further inquiries. People quoting personal messages/email messages without first receiving consent from the person you’re quoting is, in my opinion, more unethical than a person ‘advertising’ their website on Wikipedia. This is only my opinion though of course.

Me:

It was a necessary evil I had to consider quickly.

When you and Quasar start bringing up an un-related issue in a blog topic, especially one that attacks my personal character, events can quickly become “he said/he said” and it could start a flame war.

In those circumstances it’s almost impossible to verify anything objectively because the admins are the ones throwing out the accusations and not just some members.

It can also be hard to rely on members on said community because you’re not sure how much they care about a flame war starting out.

In those cases, there are a few things that can be done to quickly quell the smoke. One of them is for one side to give out all the information they knew from their perspective.

Chair:

For the record - I truly feel that adding the HikiCulture link on Wikipedia is not unethical at all considering that:

Me:

It’s not about ethics. It’s about their rules for notability. Especially when a discussion page comment has been removed around the same time.

Chair:

My forum’s subject matter is very much relevant to the Wikipedia article the link is being posted on (If I were to stick a link to my site on the Viagra Wikipedia article for example, then yes, I’d agree with you on the whole ‘spam forum’ thing. There is high relevancy though).

Me:

No, in general, forums and blogs are not notable enough for Wikipedia no matter how related they are to the topic.

Even when this forum was on there, it was highly suspect.

It could’ve been easily attributed to the lack of English links.

When this forum was removed for some reason and not returned, it cemented the fact that the Wikipedians monitoring the article have decided that the article had improved enough that the forum link could be dropped.

Unless the link to this forum was re-added and gained consensus for notability, any other forum link replacing it is equally non-notable.

Even then, the issue between re-adding a forum link and deleting a post in the discussion board is far from the same intentions.

End

It was then that Chair posted that threatening reply above.

At that point, I didn’t understand what he meant by “beat up” and I ignored the post thinking it was just a normal flame.

Before I left though, I did saw the SPAM account post some spam but I never associated the two. (At the time, it was just 1 or 2 posts)

Then a couple of people pmed me (not much, I’m not an important person in any of the Hikikomori boards) and alerted me to the issue.

At first, I was even being overtly cautious and didn’t link the two events together but it turns out this might not be the first time Chair has spammed.

There was talk of a spam attack in /hikikomori/ linked to Chair which resulted in a backlash against HikiCulture in that board. (An event I never saw but was talked about in pm)

Coupled with the other evidences above and there’s strong evidence that Chair is the spammer based on all this.

Please note that after the “Wikipedia” issue got clarified, I’ve never seen Chair spam the HikiCulture boards elsewhere so I’m not removing the HikiCulture link in this post just yet.

I will however put a warning that Chair is strongly suspected of being a spammer.

I will also try to post this link in several social media sites so for those who are reading this that are not Hikikomori or do not care for the English-speaking Hikikomori community, my apologies for blogspamming in your favorite sites. I just felt this issue was serious enough to “report” as to keep future Hikikomoris from (possibly) being associated with a spammer.

See and download the full gallery on posterous

Posted via email from A Hikikomori StopGap | Comment »

Reply to Chair/HikiCulture Admin

I recently made a topic worrying about the actions being taken on the Hikikomori Wikipedia page with regards to HikiCulture over here and two of the admins responded.

I think they are two because one named himself the HikiCulture Admin and the other named himself Chair although when I was there, Chair was the only active admin I know of since he was the creator of the forum.

Anyways, the reason I decided to make a blog post out of this instead of a direct reply underneath the comments is because of the worrying tone of both commentors. Although I do plan to paste my reply to this quote:

That whole ‘incident’ on the Wikipedia page was typed up by a frustrated member who had been banned from the forum. I had every reason to ban that member, and had been considering it already a week before I finally placed it.

Maybe both admins didn’t know but to quote the recent Wikipedia revision page… Don’t delete stuff from talk pages!

This was a potential major issue because not only was the HikiCulture link restored but the talk page which gives reasons for why HikiCulture is not notable was removed also.

Now the link in itself when restored is no big issue. Lots of people can mistake Wikipedia as an advertising portal as opposed to an encyclopedia. In fact, for a long time, the HikiPhpBB forum was underneath the External Links.

(I have no idea why some users deleted it only to replace it with HikiCulture but most forum and blog links are frowned upon in Wikipedia so there is already some controversy with regards to why the forum link was in the page)

Now add the action of deleting unresolved discussions and now you have a possibility of a person trying to censor criticisms to a site….The admins in their reply though went further than that and posted some irrelevant accusations which justifies this separate blog post:

HikiCulture Admin:
#1

This user was banned from the site for excessive spam and general trolling. We also have reason to believe he was using a proxy for nefarious reasons. His username “foolness” is very accurate, as he acted like one at every opportunity he got, despite warnings from staff.

This was weird not so much due to the accusation.It was more of a question as to why this was brought up and how much of this was true. Username hijacking was a common worry of mine but at the same time, I do know that I’m not worth the time.

(In fact in the now defunct /hikki/ AnonIB board, someone even said that my way of speaking was distinct enough that it would be hard to pretend as me.)

Still…

Such comments often fall under a “You said, I said” model so one of the convenience of making a separate blog post for this was that I could post this topic in other Hikikomori boards and hopefully, current members of HikiCulture visiting there could verify what happened after I got banned.

Btw, my personal recollection of what happened is located here. …or for those who don’t want to click on the link:

Ok, I was banned for the second time in HikiCulture (I don’t know the reason why. It could have something to do with that announcement that something changed in their profiles but since I never put any data in there, I never bothered tweaking it but soon I saw my account/posts disappear despite remaining active. In fact, my account was deleted around the same time I wrote a reply. It wasn’t a controversial one and it was attributing the fact that despite the admin’s criticisms with the HikiPhpBB forum, the member base growth remained the same and in fact, the previous forum probably had more Hikikomori related topics although it wasn’t the fault of the forum design as there were certain key members that stopped being active at around the time the forum required these members to stay active. This is why I’m not attributing it to a case of breaking some obscure rule but treat this as a warning if you plan to join that forum.I normally don’t like re-joining forums so I won’t be signing up for another account there. I did sign up a 2nd time because at the time, my first trial was so short I wasn’t able to preview most of the forum’s contents.)

Also when my account was banned for the first time, in a private pm located in HikiPhpBB:

Yeah sorry, some members got pruned after I created new rules. You are welcome to join again, just be sure to be active to prevent automatic pruning.

Sent at: Wed Aug 19, 2009 6:35 pm
From: Chair
To: Foolness

Btw for those wondering why I would have a private conversation with Chair at another forum, the reason was because Chair originally invited me to HikiCulture via a PM in HikiPhpBB.

#2

And fyi, foolness: Many people is this world with AS has done great things. If you want to give yourself credibility, do not make fun of those with medical conditions, you just end up looking “foolish”. :P

This was another weird comment because I didn’t feel like I made any comment that is directed at anyone with Asperger Syndrome. (I am guessing that is what AS meant) Still, if anyone is willing to mediate, I would be open to anyone pointing out where I made fun of them in that thread.Obviously I’m biased to myself while I am wary of HikiCulture Admin’s motives so if anyone else would like to point out which section sent that wrong interpretation, I’m all ears and would edit that portion out.

#3

Please do me two favors: 1.) Do your research before childlessly laying down groundless claims, and 2.) Accept the fact that you were banned, grow up, and move on. All you have accomplished by writing this, is making the site appear higher in Google. You saved us some trouble, thanks a lot!

I really don’t know where I am laying down groundless claims and not accepting my banning, so again, if anyone can mediate I would appreciate the help.I would really like to assume that HikiCulture Admin’s words are based on something valid and not just mud slinging but frankly I can’t interpret it any other way.

Chair:

#1

I have not received any site complaints from anyone in the IRC channel (about a quarter of the forum’s users enter the IRC chatroom each day), nor have I received complaints through personal messages or emails.

This is actually the reverse. If any current HikiCulture member can mediate for me and point out how the topic had nothing to do with complaints by members, I would again appreciate the help. …The rest of the section didn’t seem related to me or the topic, so I just copy pasted it in the Wikipedia talk page over here:http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talk:Hikikomori#Linking_to_sites_which_aren.27t_much_help

Finally, I apologize if I thanked people generally too much in this thread. These kinds of replies are the kind that make me want to explode at a person because they seem so off-base and reek of insults for insult’s sake and yet there’s a strong possibility that there was only a misunderstanding so to counter and prevent any unnecessary flaming on my part, I am trying to be as polite as possible.

Posted via email from A Hikikomori StopGap | Comment »

Is HikiCulture turning more and more into a spam forum?

This is another placeholder topic but one slightly more serious:

First off, I’ve no doubt that - for members of this forum - this could easily come off as a HikiPhpBB vs. HikiCulture vs. AnonIB /hikikomori/ thread.

Unfortunately, it doesn’t help that coincidentally I’ve made a recent return post on HikiPhpBB.

This isn’t intentional but is a result of me just being frustrated and bored so I decided to re-check the Hikikomori boards I know of (except Sankaku and HikiCulture)

Sankaku because it’s a news site and I’m too busy to add further information overload unto myself and HikiCulture because I’ve been banned.

Another major blow to my bias but I’ll let you decide how much based on this incident:

From a recent revision of the Hikikomori wikipedia page discussion board:

I’ve been a member on a few Hikikomori and recluse forums and websites for a while now. “HikiCulture” keeps being linked to here, but it generally is not a good place for information and help. It’s still fairly new and the administrator has no idea on how to run a forum correctly and generally doesn’t understand that the site is for people who need help and information. He overreacts and abuses control without thinking about his actions, and he has Asperger’s Sydrome which hinders his decisive abilities, causing harsh and uncalled-for actions which may offend. He also bans people for things which are petty and do not require action. It’s generally a place to avoid due to this. The community itself is great, but the administrator known to some as “Chair” isn’t good for the community. I’ve heard of other Hikikomori sites opening soon for giving advice and help and they’ll be linked to here once they have been created.

Also, I am not meaning to cause offense, I have been asked to write this comment by a lot of members of the community at “HikiCulture”. The way it’s ran is unfair and the staff do not care about us with mental conditions, reclusiveness, depression and social anxiety. It’s not wise to link to “HikiCulture” any further.

Now I didn’t write this and I only had a short time on HikiCulture so I have no way of verifying this but what’s worrying is that this comment was up a few days ago.

I don’t participate much in Wikipedia but the argument while not verifying to me that it was accurate, did convince me that there was ample reason to remove the HikiCulture link from the main article so I decided to do so.

What’s worrying and why I am being harsh and calling it spam is that not only was the link restored but that the above quote was also removed.

…

Now I get that there’s no proof of any persistant trolling nor is this even a rare issue for most wikipedia articles but it is kind of worrying that the Hikikomori label may be starting to be used as a marketing tactic and that’s why I’m preserving these quotes in case it never gets restored.

(I’ve no patience for wikipedia edit wars.)

I also fully accept the responsibility that I may be accused of doing the same thing with this blog and this may come off as hypocritical mud-slinging by me but since I have no way to prove my integrity, I could only give my word that I don’t have an agenda against Hiki-Culture but it would be heart breaking if future Hikikomoris gather in the wrong place due to wikipedians’ neglect of protecting the Hikikomori article from such edits.

Therefore even if the word “spam” can be interpreted as sensationalism, this would have to stay to serve as linkbait in case the issue becomes more drastic in the future.

Posted via email from A Hikikomori StopGap | Comment »

A major criticism of Hikikomori PHPBB and HikiCulture

This is actually nothing new but I’m posting this anyway to highlight the problem.

While finally deciding to re-register to Hiki-Culture, I was met with these two questions:

Will you be sure to create AT LEAST one post/thread within a week of completing this registration form to prevent your HikiCulture account from getting deleted?: *
Please be honest when answering this. If you select ‘No’, staff will delete your account.

After posting your intial mandatory first post within a week of joining up to this site, will you be sure to create one post or thread per month and log in AT LEAST once a month to prevent your HikiCulture account from getting deleted?: *
Please be honest when answering this. If you select ‘No’, staff will delete your account.

Of course, I knew this because my account was purged due to inactivity. I didn’t know the exact timeline though because as far as I can remember, the questions were new. Not that it should surprise me, but it did.

I guess there’s something about seeing the numbers in perspective but I just can’t help but think of the comparison of posting once a month vs. a general private torrent site without a strict rule.

Sites that create this rule just seem so… anti-Hikkikomori. Compare this with your average private torrent ratio rule and despite a longer headstart to get the right ratio so that you can comfortably leave your account alone, I would say a good estimate for causing your account to get deleted is leaving it for 6 months. Even then you can say there’s a much more valid reason for the deadline and that 6 months is enough even for the most avid of lurkers to post in a forum (without feeling forced).

“A month” though…

That’s the sad thing separating English Hikkimori communities. There’s just no “moderate” community right now. It’s either all anonymous or private “post-a-lots” outside of topics in general boards.

Of course I’m not saying don’t join either forums especially since I’m going to join anyway and I don’t know of any other place outside of the three boards. However consider this a warning or even an advise saying “don’t bother” if you’re new to forums and thought to work it through. A month is shorter than it would normally seem over the internet. Maybe one day there’s a better platform for “silent” Hikis to get information and support without needing to join such frisky communities. (Still no idea what the ideal model for this is though. Even the Hiki IRC failed to attract a large enough group to support 24/7 discussions.)

Edit: Speaking of new sites, I just saw this linked in Hiki-Culture.

http://www.experienceproject.com/group_stories.php?g=142181&s=d

Source: http://hikiculture.prophpbb.com/topic138.html